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> Cairo's Six - Ready for the Next Evolution?, 3.2 out, 3.6 going in.
Cairo94507
post Feb 18 2024, 10:11 AM
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Hi Everyone -

Some may be aware I recently bought the '95 993 3.6 motor Chris (Tygaboy) had for sale. I must have looked at his ad a 100 times (IMG:style_emoticons/default/drooley.gif) and finally could not resist. Had it not been Chris and pretty local to me I probably would have passed.

The 3.6 has approximately 18K miles on it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif) and came out of the 993 in 1997 following an accident. The engine was properly stored with rocker arms loosed and oil poured in the cylinders and turned over regularly. I pulled the plugs and it turned over like a new engine. Squirted some oil in, reinstalled the plugs and have turned it over a few times since it came to my garage patiently awaiting the swap.

Greg T. (master mechanic/technician/body man and painter) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/pray.gif) and a very good friend agreed to tackle this project at his garage. So on Friday (2/16/24), we drove to Greg's (it ran great) and a short 5+ hours later the 3.2 was out. We took our time and the biggest hassle was pulling the wiring harness for the 3.2 out of the car without damaging anything. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

The next day we trailered my Six in Greg's enclosed trailer, pulled by his wife's beautiful Dodge Ram diesel, to the Red Barn! Yes, Chris, (master fabricator if ever there was one) another great guy and good friend @Tygaboy agreed to do some metal fabrication as a part of this swap. After seeing Chris' skills on multiple projects, (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smilie_pokal.gif) I knew if someone was going to be cutting (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sawzall-smiley.gif) and welding (IMG:style_emoticons/default/welder.gif) on my car. I really wanted it to be him. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/pray.gif)

After looking at the current oil cooler setup, (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) it was decided to leave my existing GT style oil cooler and add the 2 Spal 6.5" fans and see how that works. My 3.2 stayed cool while driving unless I got in stop 'n go traffic (What? None of that in the Bay Area!) and then the temperature would creep up. We will relocate my oil cooler thermostat from the front trunk (where the factory installed them in the GT cars (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif) ) to the engine firewall- where we all agreed it belonged. I have to give Chris credit for this plan as I originally was going to swap in a larger oil cooler and open the nose panel of my car up (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sawzall-smiley.gif) to mate to the new cooler with a nice duct (IMG:style_emoticons/default/welder.gif) . Chris pulled me back from the edge and said he believed cutting the nose panel out may not be necessary once the fans are installed.

Of course that is not all Chris is doing. My car has factory, non-retractible, seat belts and my brother and I prefer retractible belts. So we are installing retractible belts. Chris will do the fabrication; he did this to his LS car and it works flawlessly.

OK, here are some pictures to get this thread rolling; I hope you enjoy following along as this stuff happens.

Again, a sincere thanks (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tiphat2.gif) to Greg T, Chris B., my brother Bob, HB (2 914 owner and good friend), for their support and encouragement. And thanks to anyone who has done a 3.6 swap into a 914 and posted about it so we have a road map. I will document our project to hopefully make it easier for others to do the same.

Cheers- Michael (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

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ndfrigi
post Feb 18 2024, 10:56 AM
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Congratulations Michael!
Hoping that solid 3.2 will be going to a good car also!
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SirAndy
post Feb 18 2024, 11:28 AM
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You'll love the difference!

On the cooling, just remember that unlike the 3.2L, the 3.6L does not have an engine mounted cooler.

Whatever you're running for a cooler up front has to do 100% of the oil cooling.
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tygaboy
post Feb 18 2024, 12:07 PM
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The Red Barn isn't sure what's going on. It's never seen a 914 that wasn't ratty or horribly rusted or getting modified in some strange way. I can almost hear it saying "You're telling me THAT'S what a 914 is supposed to look like?" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif)

@Cairo94507 Michael - I'll post pics as I make progress so you'll have full documentation of everything. I'm honored you trust me with your car but I have to say, it's nerve-wracking to have something this nice in the shop...
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Cairo94507
post Feb 18 2024, 12:38 PM
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Thanks Chris- The honor is all mine; I totally trust you with my car. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
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technicalninja
post Feb 18 2024, 12:42 PM
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QUOTE(SirAndy @ Feb 18 2024, 11:28 AM) *

You'll love the difference!

On the cooling, just remember that unlike the 3.2L, the 3.6L does not have an engine mounted cooler.

Whatever you're running for a cooler up front has to do 100% of the oil cooling.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)


I'm a HUGE believer in staged/in-series coolers.

If the 3.2 was having trouble in traffic the 3.6 (with fewer coolers) will be worse!

Before I chopped up the body and fitted a larger front cooler I'd try something like Chris Foleys new 4-cylinder rear mounted cooler as the primary followed by the existing front cooler. I'd most likely run the rear cooler direct and the front cooler after the thermostat.

Food for thought...

The whole kit is un-necessary in a 6. The rear mount and the "Setrab" cooler is what I'd be after. Setrabs by themselves are not expensive; I'd get the largest one that will fit.

https://setrabusa.com/collections/engine-oi...er.v.price.lte=

https://tangerineracing.com/shop/ols/produc...oil-cooler-kits
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Cairo94507
post Feb 18 2024, 01:55 PM
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Thanks technicalninja; I know you know your stuff and I appreciate your thoughts.

To be fair, my front end was a stock front bumper (no GT modification) with a GT modified valance. For air flow, I had the 5 round rubber plugs in the nose panel removed.

I realized I was having rising temps in sitting traffic during the summer so I had a front bumper "GT modified" to match the valance, essentially doubling the air inlet opening and have had very good results like that. However, since I am going to the 3.6 with no engine mounted cooler, I will start with adding the 2 Spal 6.5" fans with a programable thermostat and see how that works. If that doesn't get it done, I will then open the nose up, essentially connecting the round body plugs and see what that does. If that does not provide a solution, I will replace my current oil cooler with a larger one that I have.

Cheers,

Michael (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
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SirAndy
post Feb 18 2024, 02:21 PM
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QUOTE(Cairo94507 @ Feb 18 2024, 11:55 AM) *
I realized I was having rising temps in sitting traffic during the summer so I had a front bumper GT modified to match the valance, essentially doubling the air inlet opening and have had very good results like that. However, since I am going to the 3.6 with no engine mounted cooler, I will start with adding the 2 Spal 6.5" fans with a programable thermostat and see how that works. If that doesn't get it done, I will then open the nose up, essentially connecting the round body plugs and see what that does. If that does not provide a solution, I will replace my current oil cooler with a larger one that I have.

How are you currently exhausting the air?
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

I'm guessing you don't really want to cut into this car.
Before i cut the hood and added the shroud i simply removed the two large plugs in the trunk floor. While that did somewhat work, you could see the hood lifting at higher speeds and the front end felt very unstable above 80.
Adding a shroud would help with that but the surface area of those holes probably won't be enough to keep your motor cool. Plus, you'll be dumping all that hot air under the car, which is the last place where you would want that.

Anyways, after all the things i have tried, out the top is still by far the best option in terms of air flow and down-force but i understand that the look is not for everyone.
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mepstein
post Feb 18 2024, 02:43 PM
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Michael has a louvered pan. I’m still waiting on mine - lol.
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rick 918-S
post Feb 18 2024, 02:56 PM
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Cairo94507
post Feb 18 2024, 02:57 PM
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Hi Andy - I have an aluminum shroud that seals the oil cooler and once I add the 2 fans, the fans so air will exhaust out the louvered panel in the trunk floor. That should provide sufficient air flow. If not, Plan B goes into effect.

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Dion
post Feb 18 2024, 03:15 PM
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Best of luck Michael. It’ll be superb.
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Cairo94507
post Feb 18 2024, 03:35 PM
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Fingers crossed! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
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East coaster
post Feb 18 2024, 04:00 PM
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My 3.6 used to run very cool with my fronted cooler. I had a couple fans installed but never needed them even on 95+ degree days stuck in traffic. I turned them on once when stuck in traffic and it brought the needle down a bit, but it wasn’t necessary.

That said, I did have the area where the holes are joined so it was one oblong opening to feed the cooler.
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tygaboy
post Feb 18 2024, 04:28 PM
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QUOTE(East coaster @ Feb 18 2024, 02:00 PM) *

My 3.6 used to run very cool with my fronted cooler. I had a couple fans installed but never needed them even on 95+ degree days stuck in traffic. I turned them on once when stuck in traffic and it brought the needle down a bit, but it wasn’t necessary.

That said, I did have the area where the holes are joined so it was one oblong opening to feed the cooler.

@East coaster - If adding the fans doesn't cool things appropriately, cutting open between the holes is exactly what we agreed we'd do as the next step in the plan. Thanks and please keep the experiences coming!
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Craigers17
post Feb 18 2024, 05:41 PM
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What are the odds this car leaves the Red Barn with a V-8 in it? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif)
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Freezin 914
post Feb 18 2024, 07:41 PM
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KELTY360
post Feb 18 2024, 08:24 PM
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QUOTE(Craigers17 @ Feb 18 2024, 03:41 PM) *

What are the odds this car leaves the Red Barn with a V-8 in it? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif)


A flat eight would be more appropriate.
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technicalninja
post Feb 18 2024, 08:29 PM
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QUOTE(Cairo94507 @ Feb 18 2024, 02:57 PM) *

Hi Andy - I have an aluminum shroud that seals the oil cooler and once I add the 2 fans, the fans so air will exhaust out the louvered panel in the trunk floor. That should provide sufficient air flow. If not, Plan B goes into effect.

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Took my breath away!

That's just freaking gorgeous!

I'm so envious...

Put a temporary manometer in the duct (precise pressure gauge) and actually measure pressure BEFORE you cut out those beautiful louvers!
Opening front OK in my book.
Adding fans, just brain dead, automatically do it on anything that is used as a streetcar.
Changing the way that front trunk looks would be the very LAST mod I'd do...

Chris, I have 100k+ classics commonly here for AC work.
Not a one of them matches that car...
I'd be nervous around that!
I'd NOT ALLOW "randoms" within ten feet of that.

The Cobra 427 replica on my business website drew in people like nothing else I've ever encountered when it visited. it had a 50K paint job and everyone just had to "touch it". I couldn't park it outside. I had to threaten an "industrial" salesman once!

I just had to fix that Cobra.
You've got to CUT that car, maybe...
Still, it's SOOO much better to be doing that, on that nice a car, than fixing appliance vehicles like me.

Envious of you both!

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nivekdodge
post Feb 18 2024, 08:36 PM
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QUOTE(Craigers17 @ Feb 18 2024, 06:41 PM) *

What are the odds this car leaves the Red Barn with a V-8 in it? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif)



Just one?

Kevin
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